I’m Danny Garcia, campus pastor here at Grace Christian University. Joining me today is Pastor Bill Riggs, a man who has spent over seventy years doing ministry, and Professor Jake Rogers, who teaches here at Grace and whose life was personally changed by Bill’s.
DANNY: How did you get into ministry? That’s my first question.
BILL: I’m from South Chicago. My mother, who was, I should mention, a pretty good poker player, started to attend a Bible study. She was coming back to Christ, and she didn’t even know it. She had run away from the church when she was a kid, kind of a rebellious seventeen-year-old back in Indiana. I came along pretty late in their life. I was fifteen years old. My mom had started attending this Bible study and needed a ride. Because both my parents were handicapped, I had the chance to take her. And instead of waiting in the car, she invited me to wait in the kitchen. She knew where I was at that stage of life, where it was cars, girls, and sports. Not necessarily in that order.
I didn’t realize the unusual relationship that exists between Christianity and the coffee industry, because after all the mumbo jumbo and the Bible business in the other room, everybody comes into the kitchen. And the last guy literally rolled into the kitchen. His name was Raymond Erd, severely disabled with cerebral palsy, I found out later. The conversation that night was about how Ray was going to get to camp up in Michigan. The shorter story is that I got volunteered, and I got paid for it. A couple of months later, in 1954, I took Ray Erd up to Grace Youth Camp. Little did I know that was the method God was using to bring me to himself. I consider Grace Youth Camp, now called Grace Adventures, my birthplace.
Sixty-Five Years of Partnership
DANNY: Tell us about SALT Ministries and what you’ve been building.
BILL: This is our fiftieth year of doing SALT Ministries; Nancy and I started in the state of Michigan. Nancy was a wonderful pianist, and we were together for sixty-five years before she passed away three years ago. We did a lot of music together, a lot of concert work. I’ve been an interim pastor at sixteen different churches over the years. A lot of my relationships were with persons rather than with groups. For instance, Dr. Ed Erickson, who became my very best friend, I met at camp when we were both fifteen. He became head of the English department at Calvin College, was friends with the Solzhenitsyn family, and served as spokesperson for Alexander Solzhenitsyn in this country. We traveled to Russia together, the Soviet Union. My mother didn’t think I could hold a job.
DANNY: And look at you now, still going.
When Dawn Came to Christ
DANNY: I’d love to hear the story of how you got connected with Jake’s mom. Can you share that?
BILL: In the early nineties, I got a call from a gal who worked at a large company north of here. She said her supervisor had confided in her that she intended to take her life the next day. She was calling me because I had been her youth pastor at one time in Muskegon. Would I be willing to meet with her supervisor, her being Dawn? I said sure. Some of my meetings at that time were held at the Big Boy restaurant on Pearl Street in downtown Grand Rapids. In comes Dawn, smiley, not very talkative, but smiley. We talked. And eventually in that conversation, I was able to buy some time with her. She’s going to wait. Not pull the plug just yet. Let’s talk again. And we talked again and again and again. And finally, the Spirit moved in her life, and she came to Christ.
BILL: There was another girl about her age at the same time named Margaret, who had many of the same issues. I was counseling both of them. And as a result, both of them asked if Nancy and I would become their parents, so to speak. We agreed, and we still are to this day. I just got a card from Margaret the other day, a woman who decided to live instead of die. And Dawn, same thing. I’ve got two daughters who call me Papa and call Nancy Mama. I answer my phone, and oftentimes it’s “Grandpa” on the other end. And I’m usually right.
JAKE: I was about four years old when Bill first met my mom. The relationship I’ve had with Bill has often been through his kids and grandkids. Luther and I grew up together. I’d get off the bus, walk down the street to Luther’s house, and hang out all day. His mom Melanie would teach me the Bible. She was my babysitter and my other mom. When Bill talked about the body of Christ being the family of God more literally than figuratively, that’s how I learned what family was. Family was less about the people I was related to by blood and more about the people I was connected to through Christ, who had welcomed me into their homes.
BILL: Because of his blood.
JAKE: Because of his blood. That’s right. To this day, the people I’m closest with are the ones I’ve spent my life living among in the body of Christ.
A Wandering Sheep Comes Home
JAKE: My dad was diagnosed with cancer in 2001. You had known him before he came to the Lord and after. It wasn’t until that diagnosis that his life really turned around; he dedicated himself to learning more about God and serving others. From your perspective, what did you see during that time?
BILL: When I first heard about your dad, I didn’t like him very much from what your mom told me. And then she kept telling me more, and I liked him even less. I hadn’t met him yet, but I advised your mom to think twice about sticking around. And she said, God bless her, “He’s a good dad, bad husband. Good dad.” And that was the truth. Finally the day came, because she had come to Christ, that her life and her words made the difference in his. He was a playboy. Scotty was a fun guy. But he had a lot more depth than that. A lot more going on beneath the surface. Your mom got through to him on a level that God used to bring him to himself. He was a wandering sheep, wandering in pastures that seemed happy but weren’t the ones he needed to be in. And God plucked him out of there and brought him home. When he did, it was just a joy to be with your papa.
Embracing Grief
DANNY: You’ve experienced a lot of loss, your wife being the most recent, but also your granddaughter and your son. You’ve mentioned Psalm 88 a few times. What is your advice for those who are grieving?
BILL: Jesus didn’t reach up and try to get the thorns off his head. They were stuck there as part of the way he would die. He didn’t necessarily embrace the thorns, but they were certainly a part of his life. And to embrace grief, if you know what the final chapter is, is to embrace hope at the same time. To know that it’s not the last chapter. Jimmy, when he died at fifteen, he died suddenly. And he knew definitively where he was going. So yeah, I think of him. I visit his gravesite. Sometimes I laugh my head off. Sometimes I lay down on top of it. Sometimes I just cry. And I call that healthy grieving. Jesus was a man of sorrows and acquainted with grief. How do you get acquainted with grief? It’s something you always want to push aside.
BILL: Kevin was with me when he got the news that his daughter Olivia, twenty-nine years old, had been killed. He happened to be at my house when the news came. He shuddered. And I understand what shuddering is. I held him as he heard that his daughter had been killed up in Traverse City. But it’s going to happen. And with all of these interconnections, you can almost visualize what the body of Christ is really all about. It’s more literal than figurative. Because we have bodies. We live our lives out on this earth. And those bodies are going to experience what bodies experience.
JAKE: With everything you’ve experienced through grief, how has God used that to shape your life and to draw others deeper into relationship with him?
BILL: The whole message that we’re responsible for believing and spreading is a message of life and death. This isn’t about gumdrops and cotton candy. This is real stuff. If the theology doesn’t resonate with the life, there’s either something wrong with your life or something wrong with your theology, because those things need to come together. If your theology doesn’t minister to your life, and your life doesn’t live out your theology, what have you got?
Never Retiring
DANNY: You mentioned you don’t want to retire. What does that look like day to day?
BILL: How can you retire from family? Every day I wake up just like you do, and I have things to do, places to go, and people to see. The datebook at the beginning of the week is sometimes empty. But by the end of the week it’s filled up pretty well. I give the gift of delegation. It almost looks like laziness sometimes. I probably am lazy. There are linear people and there are circular people. Linear people are the list-makers of life. I am not a linear person. I’ve been going in circles my whole life. But I had a good, linear wife. It was a wonderful combination.
A Word to the Listeners
DANNY: Is there anything you’d want to say to listeners, something that would empower people to do the work of Christ?
BILL: There’s plenty of opportunity. You just decide. Deciding to serve the Lord is an objective decision that you make, and you can do it within the terms of your own personality. There’s a difference between the gifts of the Spirit and the fruit of the Spirit. Everybody can demonstrate the fruit of the Spirit. And if you do, the gifts will show up. In ministry, a lot of what I do is set the table. Whether people sit down and partake, that’s between them and the Lord. I try to create a climate where they can make the important choices of life freely. Your prayer life becomes a matter of putting the Lord between you and the circumstances, instead of letting the circumstances stand between you and the Lord. Incidentally, Psalm 88 is a prayer. It’s amazing that we’re not only fellow heirs but fellow workers.
Closing
DANNY: I feel like we’ve only scratched the surface. I would love to have both of you back. But I think this is the best place to land, to inspire people to do the work of Christ, to be engaged in their faith, and to be moved and ready to respond. Thank you so much, Bill, for being here.
BILL: It’s my privilege to have been, over so many years, a part of Grace Christian University. I thank God for the roots that were here and the seeds that were planted. I’m a grateful, thankful man.
DANNY: And we are so thankful for you. If you’re listening, go check out Psalm 88. Pray it. Study it. See how it might impact your life in a deep, deep way. Thank you guys so much.
